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<div class=Section1>

<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D'>Hi Rich,<o:p></o:p></span></p>

<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p>

<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D'>Thank you for putting this document together. Here are few of my
thoughts;<o:p></o:p></span></p>

<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p>

<p class=MsoNormal><b><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D'>Prioritization:<o:p></o:p></span></b></p>

<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D'>I think that we should prioritize these use cases as to what we
think it is more important (actually what our customers think is more
important) to enable us better focus on the right problems. My prioritization
is as follow (extracted from your list),<o:p></o:p></span></p>

<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p>

<p class=MsoListParagraph style='text-indent:-.25in;mso-list:l1 level1 lfo1'><![if !supportLists]><span
style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><span
style='mso-list:Ignore'>1.<span style='font:7.0pt "Times New Roman"'>      
</span></span></span><![endif]><span dir=LTR></span><span style='font-size:
11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>Process failure<o:p></o:p></span></p>

<p class=MsoListParagraph style='margin-left:.75in;text-indent:-.25in;
mso-list:l1 level2 lfo1'><![if !supportLists]><span style='font-size:11.0pt;
font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><span style='mso-list:Ignore'>1.1<span
style='font:7.0pt "Times New Roman"'>   </span></span></span><![endif]><span
dir=LTR></span><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D'>single process failure<o:p></o:p></span></p>

<p class=MsoListParagraph style='margin-left:.75in'><span style='font-size:
11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>One process failed; either
crashed or complete lack of contact from any of the connected ranks.<o:p></o:p></span></p>

<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p>

<p class=MsoListParagraph style='margin-left:.75in;text-indent:-.25in;
mso-list:l1 level2 lfo1'><![if !supportLists]><span style='font-size:11.0pt;
font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><span style='mso-list:Ignore'>1.2<span
style='font:7.0pt "Times New Roman"'>   </span></span></span><![endif]><span
dir=LTR></span><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D'>multiple process failure<o:p></o:p></span></p>

<p class=MsoListParagraph style='margin-left:.75in'><span style='font-size:
11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>Multiple processes
failed; either crashed or complete lack of contact to any of them from the
connected ranks.<o:p></o:p></span></p>

<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p>

<p class=MsoListParagraph style='text-indent:-.25in;mso-list:l1 level1 lfo1'><![if !supportLists]><span
style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><span
style='mso-list:Ignore'>2.<span style='font:7.0pt "Times New Roman"'>      
</span></span></span><![endif]><span dir=LTR></span><span style='font-size:
11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>Link failure<o:p></o:p></span></p>

<p class=MsoListParagraph style='margin-left:.75in;text-indent:-.25in;
mso-list:l1 level2 lfo1'><![if !supportLists]><span style='font-size:11.0pt;
font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><span style='mso-list:Ignore'>2.1<span
style='font:7.0pt "Times New Roman"'>   </span></span></span><![endif]><span
dir=LTR></span><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D'>two ranks/nodes cannot communicate directly, while other can communicate
with both of them<o:p></o:p></span></p>

<p class=MsoListParagraph style='margin-left:.75in;text-indent:-.25in;
mso-list:l1 level2 lfo1'><![if !supportLists]><span style='font-size:11.0pt;
font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><span style='mso-list:Ignore'>2.2<span
style='font:7.0pt "Times New Roman"'>   </span></span></span><![endif]><span
dir=LTR></span><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D'>group of nodes cannot communicate while other nodes can
communicate with both groups<o:p></o:p></span></p>

<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p>

<p class=MsoListParagraph style='text-indent:-.25in;mso-list:l1 level1 lfo1'><![if !supportLists]><span
style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><span
style='mso-list:Ignore'>3.<span style='font:7.0pt "Times New Roman"'>      
</span></span></span><![endif]><span dir=LTR></span><span style='font-size:
11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>network partition<o:p></o:p></span></p>

<p class=MsoListParagraph style='margin-left:.75in;text-indent:-.25in;
mso-list:l1 level2 lfo1'><![if !supportLists]><span style='font-size:11.0pt;
font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><span style='mso-list:Ignore'>3.1<span
style='font:7.0pt "Times New Roman"'>   </span></span></span><![endif]><span
dir=LTR></span><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D'>network failure partitioning the ranks to two or more disconnected
groups (each group is connected)<o:p></o:p></span></p>

<p class=MsoListParagraph style='margin-left:.75in'><span style='font-size:
11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>(there is some
similarity here to process failure as seen from one group view)<o:p></o:p></span></p>

<p class=MsoListParagraph style='margin-left:.75in'><span style='font-size:
11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p>

<p class=MsoListParagraph style='text-indent:-.25in;mso-list:l1 level1 lfo1'><![if !supportLists]><span
style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><span
style='mso-list:Ignore'>4.<span style='font:7.0pt "Times New Roman"'>      
</span></span></span><![endif]><span dir=LTR></span><span style='font-size:
11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>performance degradation<o:p></o:p></span></p>

<p class=MsoListParagraph style='margin-left:.75in;text-indent:-.25in;
mso-list:l1 level2 lfo1'><![if !supportLists]><span style='font-size:11.0pt;
font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><span style='mso-list:Ignore'>4.1<span
style='font:7.0pt "Times New Roman"'>   </span></span></span><![endif]><span
dir=LTR></span><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D'>the throughput, the latency or processing time has degraded
between two ranks<o:p></o:p></span></p>

<p class=MsoListParagraph style='margin-left:.75in;text-indent:-.25in;
mso-list:l1 level2 lfo1'><![if !supportLists]><span style='font-size:11.0pt;
font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><span style='mso-list:Ignore'>4.2<span
style='font:7.0pt "Times New Roman"'>   </span></span></span><![endif]><span
dir=LTR></span><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D'>the overall performance has degraded across all or most ranks<o:p></o:p></span></p>

<p class=MsoListParagraph style='margin-left:.75in'><span style='font-size:
11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>(e.g., network is flooded;
all processes moved to power save state)<o:p></o:p></span></p>

<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p>

<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D'>I think that we can discuss these scenarios and consolidate some
of them for the sake of simplicity. However I think that they require
discussion as the application might want to behave differently.<o:p></o:p></span></p>

<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p>

<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p>

<p class=MsoNormal><b><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D'>Expected Application Action:<o:p></o:p></span></b></p>

<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D'>I also found it to be a big leap going from the network case to
the notification mechanism. In the use case document I would expect to understand
first what are the possible actions that the application might want to take. Having
that will give us some insight as to what are the possible steps required to
enable the application FT.<o:p></o:p></span></p>

<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p>

<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p>

<p class=MsoNormal><b><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D'>Layered approach:<o:p></o:p></span></b></p>

<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D'>I think that when coming to enable FT for MPI application I
would like to go with some layered approach where in each level we enable more
FT (but with an associate cost) this allow us to better think about how to
enable FT and for applications to choose their level of FT and cost. For example,
we can layer our approach for solution(s) as follow<o:p></o:p></span></p>

<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p>

<p class=MsoListParagraph style='text-indent:-.25in;mso-list:l0 level1 lfo2'><![if !supportLists]><span
style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><span
style='mso-list:Ignore'>1.<span style='font:7.0pt "Times New Roman"'>      
</span></span></span><![endif]><span dir=LTR></span><span style='font-size:
11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>Error Reporting Rules<o:p></o:p></span></p>

<p class=MsoListParagraph><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D'>This can actually go into mpi unrelated to FT. This enables applications
to handle errors at the call site with the right context (rather than in
inappropriate call site). This also enables libraries and framework to handle
their own errors rather than other library errors.<o:p></o:p></span></p>

<p class=MsoListParagraph><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p>

<p class=MsoListParagraph style='text-indent:-.25in;mso-list:l0 level1 lfo2'><![if !supportLists]><span
style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><span
style='mso-list:Ignore'>2.<span style='font:7.0pt "Times New Roman"'>      
</span></span></span><![endif]><span dir=LTR></span><span style='font-size:
11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>Collectives/Communication
integrity validation<o:p></o:p></span></p>

<p class=MsoListParagraph><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D'>Enable applications to check that all communication on a
specific communicator has been successful across all ranks participating. This enables
all ranks to pick the right code path (error/success) once the collective communication
is complete.<o:p></o:p></span></p>

<p class=MsoListParagraph><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p>

<p class=MsoListParagraph style='text-indent:-.25in;mso-list:l0 level1 lfo2'><![if !supportLists]><span
style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><span
style='mso-list:Ignore'>3.<span style='font:7.0pt "Times New Roman"'>      
</span></span></span><![endif]><span dir=LTR></span><span style='font-size:
11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>Error notification<o:p></o:p></span></p>

<p class=MsoListParagraph><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D'>Enable applications to get notification if something is wrong in
their world. This enables the scenario where applications go for a very long computation
and would like to know during the computation if any of the other ranks died so
it can be replaced.<o:p></o:p></span></p>

<p class=MsoListParagraph><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p>

<p class=MsoListParagraph style='text-indent:-.25in;mso-list:l0 level1 lfo2'><![if !supportLists]><span
style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><span
style='mso-list:Ignore'>4.<span style='font:7.0pt "Times New Roman"'>      
</span></span></span><![endif]><span dir=LTR></span><span style='font-size:
11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>Repairing<o:p></o:p></span></p>

<p class=MsoListParagraph><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D'>Once an error was detected provide as set of API’s to
enable repairing the situation; either by spawning a replacement process; that
are part of the existing communicators; or by providing a mechanism to control
a subset of processes. (we haven’t discuss this much, but in our short
discussion we already found a set of issues; like restoring the state to re-spawned
process)<o:p></o:p></span></p>

<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p>

<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D'>I think that we also need to discuss that our approach is
application assisted FT rather than automatically provide an MPI FT approach.<o:p></o:p></span></p>

<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p>

<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D'>Makes sense to you?<o:p></o:p></span></p>

<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p>

<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D'>Thanks,<o:p></o:p></span></p>

<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D'>.Erez<o:p></o:p></span></p>

<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p>

<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p>

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<p class=MsoNormal><b><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"'>From:</span></b><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"'> mpi3-ft-bounces@lists.mpi-forum.org
[mailto:mpi3-ft-bounces@lists.mpi-forum.org] <b>On Behalf Of </b>Richard Graham<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Wednesday, August 20, 2008 6:22 PM<br>
<b>To:</b> MPI 3.0 Fault Tolerance and Dynamic Process Control working Group<br>
<b>Subject:</b> [Mpi3-ft] Call this week<o:p></o:p></span></p>

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<p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p>

<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif"'>Just
a reminder that we have our weekly call scheduled this Friday, 8/22/2008.<br>
<br>
Friday - 12-2 pm EDT, 5-7 pm GMT<br>
 US Toll Free number: 877-801-8130<br>
 Toll number: 1-203-692-8690<br>
 Access Code: 1044056<br>
<br>
The plan is to present our proposed approach for error notification in MPI-3.
 I have combined several different use case scenarios from various
documents, as well as a high level description of Greg’s proposal for
event notification.  We should go over this document on the call Friday
– I don’t think it is self-consistent as it reads, but would rather
have us talk about this before making changes.  We have nothing about
MPI-I/O errors, and need to consider these too.<br>
<br>
Rich</span> <o:p></o:p></p>

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