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<BODY lang=EN-US vLink=purple link=blue>
<DIV dir=ltr align=left><SPAN class=770441922-05122008><FONT face=Arial
color=#0000ff size=2>Dear Erez,</FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV dir=ltr align=left><SPAN class=770441922-05122008><FONT face=Arial
color=#0000ff size=2></FONT></SPAN> </DIV>
<DIV dir=ltr align=left><SPAN class=770441922-05122008><FONT face=Arial
color=#0000ff size=2>Thank you. I'm afraid I would need to have it
explained in more detail why review may not include arguments on
the substance. If something in the proposal makes one think that the
proposed matter may be detrimental to the MPI standard and its implementations,
I consider it one's duty to point this out.</FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV dir=ltr align=left><SPAN class=770441922-05122008><FONT face=Arial
color=#0000ff size=2></FONT></SPAN> </DIV>
<DIV dir=ltr align=left><SPAN class=770441922-05122008><FONT face=Arial
color=#0000ff size=2>Following up on your reply: the segfault situation you
described will make an MPI compliant program break. Thus, the implementation
will have to keep the send buffer mapped into the sending process address space.
This is a limitation on the MPI implementation that should be taken into account
during the voting.</FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV dir=ltr align=left><SPAN class=770441922-05122008><FONT face=Arial
color=#0000ff size=2></FONT></SPAN> </DIV>
<DIV dir=ltr align=left><SPAN class=770441922-05122008><FONT face=Arial
color=#0000ff size=2>Another possibility that has been pointed out earlier was
that the proposed change disallows byte swap and other send buffer conversions
to be done in place. At least one historical MPI implementation was doing this
to a great avail. Who knows what is going to happen in the
future?</FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV dir=ltr align=left><SPAN class=770441922-05122008><FONT face=Arial
color=#0000ff size=2></FONT></SPAN> </DIV>
<DIV dir=ltr align=left><SPAN class=770441922-05122008><FONT face=Arial
color=#0000ff size=2>Best regards.</FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV dir=ltr align=left><SPAN class=770441922-05122008><FONT face=Arial
color=#0000ff size=2></FONT></SPAN> </DIV>
<DIV dir=ltr align=left><SPAN class=770441922-05122008><FONT face=Arial
color=#0000ff size=2>Alexander</FONT></SPAN></DIV><BR>
<DIV class=OutlookMessageHeader lang=en-us dir=ltr align=left>
<HR tabIndex=-1>
<FONT face=Tahoma size=2><B>From:</B> mpi-22-bounces@lists.mpi-forum.org
[mailto:mpi-22-bounces@lists.mpi-forum.org] <B>On Behalf Of </B>Erez
Haba<BR><B>Sent:</B> Friday, December 05, 2008 11:18 PM<BR><B>To:</B> MPI
2.2<BR><B>Subject:</B> Re: [Mpi-22] please review - Send Buffer Access (ticket
#45)<BR></FONT><BR></DIV>
<DIV></DIV>
<DIV class=Section1>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 11pt; COLOR: #1f497d; FONT-FAMILY: 'Calibri','sans-serif'">I
think that the idea is for the reviewers to check the text for any mistakes and
compatibility with the existing text, rather than check for the validity of the
proposal. The later as I recall is left for the MPI forum
assembly.<o:p></o:p></SPAN></P>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 11pt; COLOR: #1f497d; FONT-FAMILY: 'Calibri','sans-serif'"><o:p> </o:p></SPAN></P>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 11pt; COLOR: #1f497d; FONT-FAMILY: 'Calibri','sans-serif'">As
for your question, I’m sure that you can answer it yourself. </SPAN><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 11pt; COLOR: #1f497d; FONT-FAMILY: Wingdings">J</SPAN><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 11pt; COLOR: #1f497d; FONT-FAMILY: 'Calibri','sans-serif'"> If
the memory is still also mapped to the original process (as with shared memory)
that everything is fine. If the memory is removed from the original process,
than the app will get an access-violation fault.<o:p></o:p></SPAN></P>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 11pt; COLOR: #1f497d; FONT-FAMILY: 'Calibri','sans-serif'">(if
this system works on a page boundary, to take this action it needs to make sure
that there are no other allocation on the same page)<o:p></o:p></SPAN></P>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 11pt; COLOR: #1f497d; FONT-FAMILY: 'Calibri','sans-serif'"><o:p> </o:p></SPAN></P>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 11pt; COLOR: #1f497d; FONT-FAMILY: 'Calibri','sans-serif'">Thanks,<o:p></o:p></SPAN></P>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 11pt; COLOR: #1f497d; FONT-FAMILY: 'Calibri','sans-serif'">.Erez<o:p></o:p></SPAN></P>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 11pt; COLOR: #1f497d; FONT-FAMILY: 'Calibri','sans-serif'"><o:p> </o:p></SPAN></P>
<DIV>
<DIV
style="BORDER-RIGHT: medium none; PADDING-RIGHT: 0in; BORDER-TOP: #b5c4df 1pt solid; PADDING-LEFT: 0in; PADDING-BOTTOM: 0in; BORDER-LEFT: medium none; PADDING-TOP: 3pt; BORDER-BOTTOM: medium none">
<P class=MsoNormal><B><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Tahoma','sans-serif'">From:</SPAN></B><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Tahoma','sans-serif'">
mpi-22-bounces@lists.mpi-forum.org [mailto:mpi-22-bounces@lists.mpi-forum.org]
<B>On Behalf Of </B>Supalov, Alexander<BR><B>Sent:</B> Friday, December 05, 2008
2:05 PM<BR><B>To:</B> MPI 2.2<BR><B>Subject:</B> Re: [Mpi-22] please review -
Send Buffer Access (ticket #45)<o:p></o:p></SPAN></P></DIV></DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></P>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: blue; FONT-FAMILY: 'Arial','sans-serif'">Hi,</SPAN><o:p></o:p></P>
<P class=MsoNormal> <o:p></o:p></P>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: blue; FONT-FAMILY: 'Arial','sans-serif'">I'd like
to review this proposal. Let's consider the following
scenario:</SPAN><o:p></o:p></P>
<P class=MsoNormal> <o:p></o:p></P>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: blue; FONT-FAMILY: 'Arial','sans-serif'">- In the
MPI_Isend, MPI maps the send buffer into the address space of the receiving
process.</SPAN><o:p></o:p></P>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: blue; FONT-FAMILY: 'Arial','sans-serif'">- In the
matching MPI_Recv, the receiving process makes a copy of the mapped send buffer
into the receive buffer.</SPAN><o:p></o:p></P>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: blue; FONT-FAMILY: 'Arial','sans-serif'">- Once
the copy is complete, the send buffer is mapped back into the sender address
space during the wait/test call.</SPAN><o:p></o:p></P>
<P class=MsoNormal> <o:p></o:p></P>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: blue; FONT-FAMILY: 'Arial','sans-serif'">What
will happen one tries to access the send buffer in
between?</SPAN><o:p></o:p></P>
<P class=MsoNormal> <o:p></o:p></P>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: blue; FONT-FAMILY: 'Arial','sans-serif'">Best
regards.</SPAN><o:p></o:p></P>
<P class=MsoNormal> <o:p></o:p></P>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: blue; FONT-FAMILY: 'Arial','sans-serif'">Alexander</SPAN><o:p></o:p></P>
<P class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></P>
<DIV class=MsoNormal style="TEXT-ALIGN: center" align=center>
<HR align=center width="100%" SIZE=2>
</DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal style="MARGIN-BOTTOM: 12pt"><B><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Tahoma','sans-serif'">From:</SPAN></B><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Tahoma','sans-serif'">
mpi-22-bounces@lists.mpi-forum.org [mailto:mpi-22-bounces@lists.mpi-forum.org]
<B>On Behalf Of </B>Erez Haba<BR><B>Sent:</B> Friday, December 05, 2008 10:48
PM<BR><B>To:</B> MPI 2.2<BR><B>Subject:</B> [Mpi-22] please review - Send Buffer
Access (ticket #45)</SPAN><o:p></o:p></P>
<DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Calibri','sans-serif'">This proposal has
passed 1</SPAN><SUP><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 7.5pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Calibri','sans-serif'">st</SPAN></SUP><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Calibri','sans-serif'"> voting and needs
reviewers. We need 3 <U>volunteers</U> to sign-off on this proposal, plus
the 3 chapter authors to sign-off on the text.<o:p></o:p></SPAN></P></DIV>
<DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Calibri','sans-serif'"> <o:p></o:p></SPAN></P></DIV>
<DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Calibri','sans-serif'">The Chapter Authors
for<o:p></o:p></SPAN></P></DIV>
<DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Calibri','sans-serif'"> <o:p></o:p></SPAN></P></DIV>
<DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Calibri','sans-serif'">Chapter 3:
Point-to-Point Communication<o:p></o:p></SPAN></P></DIV>
<DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Calibri','sans-serif'">Chapter 5:
Collective Communication<o:p></o:p></SPAN></P></DIV>
<DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Calibri','sans-serif'">Chapter 11:
One-Sided Communication<o:p></o:p></SPAN></P></DIV>
<DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Calibri','sans-serif'"> <o:p></o:p></SPAN></P></DIV>
<DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Calibri','sans-serif'">Please add a
comment to the ticket saying that you reviewed the proposal, or please send me
your comments.<o:p></o:p></SPAN></P></DIV>
<DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Calibri','sans-serif'"> <o:p></o:p></SPAN></P></DIV>
<DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Calibri','sans-serif'">Send Buffer Access:
<A
href="https://svn.mpi-forum.org/trac/mpi-forum-web/ticket/45">https://svn.mpi-forum.org/trac/mpi-forum-web/ticket/45</A><o:p></o:p></SPAN></P></DIV>
<DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Calibri','sans-serif'"> <o:p></o:p></SPAN></P></DIV>
<DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Calibri','sans-serif'">Thanks,<o:p></o:p></SPAN></P></DIV>
<DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Calibri','sans-serif'">.Erez<o:p></o:p></SPAN></P></DIV>
<DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Calibri','sans-serif'"> <o:p></o:p></SPAN></P></DIV><PRE>---------------------------------------------------------------------<o:p></o:p></PRE><PRE>Intel GmbH<o:p></o:p></PRE><PRE>Dornacher Strasse 1<o:p></o:p></PRE><PRE>85622 Feldkirchen/Muenchen Germany<o:p></o:p></PRE><PRE>Sitz der Gesellschaft: Feldkirchen bei Muenchen<o:p></o:p></PRE><PRE>Geschaeftsfuehrer: Douglas Lusk, Peter Gleissner, Hannes Schwaderer<o:p></o:p></PRE><PRE>Registergericht: Muenchen HRB 47456 Ust.-IdNr.<o:p></o:p></PRE><PRE>VAT Registration No.: DE129385895<o:p></o:p></PRE><PRE>Citibank Frankfurt (BLZ 502 109 00) 600119052<o:p></o:p></PRE><PRE><o:p> </o:p></PRE><PRE>This e-mail and any attachments may contain confidential material for<o:p></o:p></PRE><PRE>the sole use of the intended recipient(s). Any review or distribution<o:p></o:p></PRE><PRE>by others is strictly prohibited. If you are not the intended<o:p></o:p></PRE><PRE>recipient, please contact the sender and delete all copies.<o:p></o:p></PRE></DIV><pre>---------------------------------------------------------------------
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